New Podcast: 🗣️ Talking About Talking: Why Speech & Language Needs More Than Lip Service

If you spend any amount of time in a school, you’ll hear phrases like “We’re a reading school,” “Reading is at the heart of everything we do,” and “Don’t forget to Drop Everything And Read.”

Lovely stuff.
Very wholesome.
Children surrounded by books like tiny, chaotic librarians.

But here’s something we don’t talk about nearly enough:
How on earth are children supposed to read, infer, decode, comprehend, or even guess what a fronted adverbial is… when they’re struggling to communicate in the first place?

Speech and language needs are one of the biggest, fastest-growing challenges in education — but you’d barely know it from how schools are resourced.
Reading gets posters, assemblies, badges, giant cardboard book characters, and possibly a parade.
Speech and language gets… well… usually a single overbooked specialist and a box of slightly frayed picture cards from 2007.


👧 A Personal Note: When Talking Doesn’t Come Easy

My own daughter was a late talker.

Not just “fashionably late.”
Not even “oh she’ll get there in her own time, love.”

No — properly late. The kind of late where you start Googling until your phone gently asks if you’re alright.

And in our case, her delayed speech was one of the first signs that something was different.
It eventually led to her autism diagnosis — and a whole new understanding of how much communication shapes a child’s world:

  • how they learn
  • how they play
  • how they make sense of other humans (an impossible task at the best of times)
  • and how they see themselves

So when I had the chance to speak with Jane Harris, CEO of Speech and Language UK, for my Make it Make SENDs podcast… I grabbed it.


🎙️ The Conversation We Need to Have

Jane is at the forefront of the national conversation about speech and language needs — and also at the forefront of reminding us that we’re not actually having the conversation loudly enough.

In the episode, we talk about:

  • why so many children are struggling with communication
  • why early identification is life-changing
  • how schools can support pupils even without a dedicated specialist
  • what’s wrong (and what’s hopeful) about current SEND reforms
  • why listening properly might be the most powerful intervention of all

She brings research, humanity, humour and — crucially — solutions.
Not just more paperwork (we’ve got more than enough of that, thank you).

▶️ Listen to the Episode

Make it Make SENDs #5 : Music and Inclusivity – is it even possible? with Kate Campbell-Green Detention Diaries

Music, Inclusion, and Empowerment with Kate Campbell GreenJoin us in this insightful episode as Kate Campbell Green shares her journey through music education, inclusion, and advocacy. We explore how music can be a powerful tool for social change, personal growth, and transforming educational spaces. Discover practical strategies to make music truly inclusive and inspiring at all levels.Timestamps:00:00 – Welcome and introduction to Kate Campbell Green's journey 02:23 – Setting the tone: Covid, new year, and purpose of the Make It Make Sense podcast 03:03 – Why understanding my autistic daughter enhances my work in education 04:00 – The broad role of music services in schools and misconceptions 05:38 – How music education addresses disengagement and fosters belonging 06:36 – The significance of authentic venues like Stoller Hall and Band on the Wall 09:02 – Early musical influences and pathways from DJing to education 10:33 – Growing up autistic and ADHD: challenges and the role of music as sanctuary 13:13 – The power of creative process and improvisation in music learning 16:04 – Deep dive into inclusive music education: frameworks and mental models 18:19 – The four Rs of inclusion: rapport, resilience, representation, reflection 22:21 – The culture of music departments as safe spaces 23:02 – Is education truly inclusive? Challenges and personal reflections 25:26 – Insights from Dr. Shelley Moore on inclusive practices worldwide 28:41 – The pitfalls of segregation versus genuine inclusion 31:23 – The physiological and neurological impact of music on neurodiverse learners 33:45 – How improvisation and creative frameworks foster belonging 36:43 – Building trust and relationships in disengaged learners 38:07 – The emotional weight and reward of nurturing young people through music 43:21 – The impact of engagement in real-world performance venues 48:39 – How Tameside Music Service creates opportunities for all young people 55:18 – The significance of spaces like Stoller Hall for young performers 62:37 – The role of PGCEI and professional development in advancing inclusive practice 66:35 – Practical tips for teachers: mindset, respect, and embracing complexity 68:37 – The leaky pipeline: strategies to support long-term musical journeys 75:44 – Envisioning the future: joined-up pathways and careers in music 76:54 – The need for holistic, continuous music learning from cradle to career 79:55 – Why creativity and improvisation are skills machines can't replicate 80:48 – Reflection: the people behind music education give us hope 81:16 – If policy makers listened: Just give us the money & trust educators 82:23 – Balancing life and work: personal anecdotes from Kate 86:31 – What's next: new projects, stewardship, and supporting local music ecosystemsSupport the showEnjoyed the episode? Then it’s time to join the class.👉 Head to http://www.detentiondiaries.comto read the blog, sign up for the newsletter, and join our online staffroom community.Because education doesn’t end at the classroom door — and neither does the conversation.Support the showEnjoyed the episode? Then it’s time to join the class. 👉 Head to http://www.detentiondiaries.com to read the blog, sign up for the newsletter, and join our online staffroom community. Because education doesn’t end at the classroom door — and neither does the conversation.
  1. Make it Make SENDs #5 : Music and Inclusivity – is it even possible? with Kate Campbell-Green
  2. Detention Diaries #5 – Redefining Masculinity: What does it really mean to be a man?
  3. Detention Diaries #4 What Teachers Really Need: Ross McGill on Workload, Wellbeing & the Future of Schools
  4. Make it Make SENDS #4 – Aiming for the Edges with Dr Shelley Moore. How inclusion REALLY works!
  5. Make it Make SENDs #3 – Talking About Talking: Jane Harris on Fixing the Speech and Language Crisis

😂 And Now For Something Mildly Ridiculous

Because this is Detention Diaries, I’ll leave you with something very British and very true:

If schools treated speech and language support the way they treat reading, we’d have:

  • a “Talkathon Week”
  • assemblies where teachers dramatically pronounce syllables
  • posters saying “Talking Takes You Places!”
  • and a dedicated display board titled “Our Oracy Champions” featuring a photo of that one kid who never stops chatting and has far too much confidence for a Monday morning.

Honestly, I’m not saying it would fix everything.
But I’m also not not saying that.


Thanks for reading — and a massive thank-you to Jane Harris for joining me on the podcast and for the vital work she continues to do for children, families and schools.

If you haven’t already, come join the community at www.detentiondiaries.com, and follow the chaos on Instagram, X, and YouTube.

Because sometimes, the most important conversations start long before the reading book even


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